I've told you that our staff is reading a book that was recently profiled in Time Magazine. The book is called "unChristian". The title comes from the idea that most "outsiders" of Christianity believe that today's christians no longer represent the teachings of Jesus and are in fact unChristian. In the book one of the jaw dropping facts for me was that only 9% of people who are "born again Christians" (that is they have a relationship with Christ and they believe that they will go to heaven based on His grace) - 9% of born again Christians would agree with what the author calls a "biblical worldview." If you aren't familiar with that idea of a "worldview" it simply means the lens (a series of beliefs) through which you interpret the world. He gives 8 elements of this worldview.
Here is what I'd like to do. Let's begin a discussion on these eight. I'm assuming that the readers of this blog fit the statistical norm. That means that many of you will not hold to one or more of these beliefs. I would love it, if you'd help me understand which ones of these you don't believe and why. You don't have to leave your name but let's start a discussion about these. Email a link to this blog to friends of yours who are followers of Christ and ask them to leave comments. You can e-mail the blog by clicking on the e-mail icon at the bottom of this post.
Now I know some of you are new to the blogging world and don't know how to leave a comment. It's pretty simple. Click on the link below this post that says "Comments". It might have a number beside it like "1 comment". Clicking that link will take you to a page to read others comments and will give you a chance to leave your own. NOTE: Your comment will not appear as soon as you hit "publish the comment". Since I moderate comments on this blog it may take a few hours to appear. Be patient, it will get posted.
Okay here are the 8 elements that I'd like for us to discuss. Tell me if there are certain ones you don't believe and why.
1. Jesus Christ lived a sinless life
2. God is the all powerful Creator of the universe and still rules it today
3. Salvation is a gift of God and can not be earned
4. Satan is real
5. Christians have a responsibility to share their faith with others
6. The Bible is accurate in all the principles it teaches
7. Unchanging Moral truth exist
8. That unchanging moral truth is taught in the Bible.
Discuss.
Wednesday, October 17, 2007
How you see things matters
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11 comments:
I have problems with 5,6,7,and 8.
I don't think it's my responsibility to share my faith with others. I beleive it's personal and no one's business if I attend a church and have faith and beleive in God and Jesus.
I beleive that the bible was written before and after Jesus was on the earth. Many stories and many authors and so many different denomininations tranlate it so litteraly to their points of view.
I'm not sure what you mean regarding unchanging moral truth in 7 and 8. I assume you're refering to gay folks and that it is morally wrong. No one can tell me that it is morally wrong to be gay and in long and loving relationship with a partner. I have a few gay friend's that heterosexals should envy for their love and commitment to one another. The God I beleive in loves everyone regardless of gender, sexual orientation, ethnic background, etc. I think that's why so many have quit the organized church. Most all the catholics and protestants I know still beleive and teach things that happened 2,000 yrs ago and applied to the culture then and have no revelancy for alot of folks today. My opinion, thanks for reading.
Well, personally I believe in all 8. However the number one thing I hear from my christian friends is that they don't believe in Satan as a real entity. They kind of think of things in terms of good and evil, but that those things come from people's choices which is not influenced by Satan. This I believe is the greatest deception that Satan has perpertrated on the world. To grow a generation of humans that do not regard him as a real threat is a disaster to the Kingdom of God and His church on this earth.
In response to "anonymous" October 17 at 3:54 p.m. Thanks for the great input. I have some questions I might ask later to just help me understand. Give me some time to process your comments. But let me say about your thoughts that morality was referring to gay people. I believe the guy in the book was talking about any moral truth. He was asking "Do you believe there is such a thing as moral truth in general?" Such as is it wrong to steal or kill or lie. Now it would certainly also include morality surrounding sexuality. But all kinds of sexuality. Is it wrong to commit adultery? Is it wrong to have sex outside of marriage. I don't believe it referred exclusively to homosexuality. The second part was do you believe Moral truth is taught in the Bible. Just clarifying that for others. Again thanks for your great input.
First you have to define "responsibility to share"
and "earn salvation".
But basicly I agree with all of
list if I get to define those terms. I have no responsibility to share my faith the way someone else
would define the word share. And I do earn my salvation with in the the sphere of grace God as given.
Where did this gay folks stuff come
from ? I did not see any referance
to them in the list. Does someone
have an agenda ?
I do beleive in the moral truth and I beleive in the moral truth taught in the bible as it would apply to society today and not 2000 yrs ago.
1. Jesus Christ lived a sinless life (Don’t Believe)
If Jesus was human then he sinned; all humans sin. If was sinless, then he was not human. Either way I do believe he chose to sacrifice himself for our sins.
2. God is the all powerful Creator of the universe and still rules it today (Believe)
3. Salvation is a gift of God and can not be earned (Believe)
4. Satan is real (Believe)
5. Christians have a responsibility to share their faith with others (Believe)
6. The Bible is accurate in all the principles it teaches (Don’t Believe)
From a literal perspective, the Bible was written by humans, humans are flawed; hence the bible is bound to have some inaccuracies. However, I do not take the bible literally. Admittedly I have not read the entire bible but do believe the principles taught in the bible are applicable today.
7. Unchanging Moral truth exist (Don’t Understand)
What is the unchanging moral truth?
8. That unchanging moral truth is taught in the Bible. (Don’t Understand)
What is the unchanging moral truth?
WAY TO GO GUYS. I am lovin' the comments.
To "anonymous October 18 at 10:53 a.m." By unchanging moral truth I believe the author is referring to a truth about what is right and wrong. AND it's a truth that never changes. For instance is it always wrong to murder someone. Or is it always wrong to be a pedophile. For number 7 you could say yes if you believe there is even ONE Truth about right and wrong that never changes. You and I wouldn't have to agree with what that truth is. For number 8 you'd have to say that what the Bible teaches is right and wrong is the standard for all human beings.
At least that's the way I understand what this guy is asking. Hope that helps.
Sorry to be a bore, but I believe all 8. Thankfully, that is what I was taught. I agree with Lynn that it is discouraging that people do not believe in Satan as an entity,I certainly do. I am also discouraged that (as some comments address) it is perceived that the rules should change with the times. I don't agree. Maybe the teachings apply in a different senario? That makes sense. I think the problem lies in the presentation. This is where you captivate or alienate. If someone is just beginning to learn about God, Satan,Jesus, the whole story, presentation is key. So this is the challenge with the times or culture of today,in my opinion.What is being taught shouldn't change, maybe how it is being taught should change!!!!! If people don't believe,maybe it's not that they don't want to, maybe they never had the opportunity to hear it in a real way. Although I don't disagree with theatrical, evangelical? teaching, I think newcomers easily freak out on that ... I am so blessed to have been taught in a real way. And I LOVE you guys, because you teach in the same REAL way. You take the Truth,straight from the Bible,apply it to HERE and NOW in our lives, because it DOES apply, the rules haven't changed, and you make it clear.
Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!!
In response to Ed’s comments posted on “October 18, 2007 11:49 AM”
Based on your definition of #7 I do believe moral truth exists
Your definition of #8 seems a lot more encompassing than believing one moral truth exists. I do not believe that what the bible teaches is right and wrong is the standard for ALL human beings.
I choose to believe that God in all his omnipotence has not limited his message to one book.
In the past you invited people from different religions to our service. You pointed out the similarities and differences between these religions. I loved that service. Perhaps this is not what your intended but I walked away believing God has created all these venues to convey his message.
I’m no theologian but I think there are some moral truths which transcend all these religions and it is these moral truths that serve as a human guide. For instance murder for the sake of murder (meaning not in self defense), stealing, lying, adultery (only for cultures who do not believe in polygamy, for those cultures that do believe in Polygamy is it adultery?) Goodness as I am typing these I see shades of gray, it is not clearly right or wrong for me.
Thank you for having this blog!! It is prompting me to really think about what I believe and why I believe it.
I too agree with the 8 statements, even though at times it can be difficult because our culture so often contradicts these truths. How much more difficult it must be for people who haven't had biblical truth presented to them in a way that doesn't seem archaic and irrelevant. Reading Traci's comments made me think of Jesus' teachings about wineskins. In Mark 2 and Luke 5 Jesus talked about how if new wine is put into old wineskins, it will cause the skin to burst and the wine to be lost. I believe he was making a comparison to the message of His grace (new wine) compared to the old Jewish system of trying to keep laws (old wineskins) and the fact that the old couldn't contain the power of the new. But I also believe that this is a good metaphor for bringing the powerful, unchanging truths written thousands of years ago in the bible to people today in a way that is meaningful and culturally relevant. When a church loses touch with the culture around it, I believe the message of grace is less lilkely to be heard if the delivery of the message turns people off because they can't relate to it. It's like the new wine being wasted because the wineskin isn't a suitable vessel. I think we should always strive to know our culture and show people that biblical truth that was written 2000+ years ago is really still powerful and relevant today.
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